Commander Update Beta 2021 - Soviet Feedback

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Comments

  • #32
    9 months ago
    Patrol_OmegaPatrol_Om… Posts: 306
    edited April 2021

    Remove that Commander's ability from the game as it is far from be useful or a must have
    4CP – Armored Vehicle Detection

  • #33
    9 months ago

    Soviet tanks have always been in disadvantage against Axis médium and heavy tanks because of their great armor and equal reload speed, therefore stop nerfing Soviets tanks … is discouraging for new players to get Good with this faction

  • #34
    9 months ago

    Soviet Shock Army
    I don't understand why you guys decided to remove the IL-2 Reconnaissance Overflight ability from the Soviet Shock Army commander. It's totally unfair because there are only 3 Soviet commanders who're authorized to call for a reconnaissance flight while there are 10 Ostheer commanders that have the opportunity to give a clear vision to the player. On the other hand, all the factions except SOV and OST have defaultly access to a reconnaissance ability that doesn't require any commander assistance. Major of USF, Assault Officer of UKF and Infrared Half-track of OKW can be freely used for this purpose. Nevertheless, you chose to force people to use a meaningless ability such as Armored Vehicle Detection by it with one of the most useful abilities among the Soviet commander abilities.

  • #35
    9 months ago

    Preface

    A big thanks to the people that make these updates possible. The CoH 2 community and myself appreciate your hard work. I am in the top 200 1v1 and 2v2 and enjoy big team games with friends. There are many great game changes in this patch as it stands, especially the commander portrait update. (They look fantastic!) From my CoH experience and extensive testing these final few tweaks will complete the soviets this update.

    Soviet Commander Changes

    NKVD Rifle Disruption Commander
    -Change Scorched Earth Policy to Booby Trap Territory from Urban Defense Commander;
    Scorched Earth is never used and harmful to team games. Booby Trap Territory fills the same role and is a better choice.

    Lend Lease Commander
    -Replace DShK HMG squad with Paradrop .50 HMG from USF;
    If the issue with this previously was the sound on call-in or designing a new squad, switching to paradrop should resolve this problem. Also, it's a prefect fit with the commander's theme.

    Airborne Troops Commander
    -Weapons Crate Drop: Change back to 1 CP;
    At 1 CP you have enough ammo to make 1 SVT cons and SVT cons have about the same timing of gren lmg upgrades. Acquiring PPSh penal at 2CP isn't worth it all when shock troops come in at 2CP with body armor and smoke grenade.

    Guard Rifle Combined Arms Commander
    -Change IL-2 Strafing Run to For Mother Russia;
    I understand you guys have worked hard on remaking the strafing run but there are still three other commanders with this ability. A subtle theme of this update has been the sharing of abilities previously locked on to a single commander. For Mother Russia has been left behind so far and with the large nerf to this ability, it feels appropriate here. Also, this commander has a similar structure to Counterattack Tactics making For Mother Russia an especially good fit with just a little more variety.

    Overall Commander Changes

    -Merge light AT mines into the conscript PTRS package;
    Reduces confusion with Advanced Fortifications.

    -Move Forward Headquarters ability into Advanced Fortifications. Maintain Advanced Fortifications in Anti-Infantry Tactics, Defensive Tactics, Tank Hunter Tactics, and replace Forward Headquarters in Urban Defense Tactics with Advanced Fortifications;
    This change gives more commanders the option of forward headquarters and moves this ability to 2CP now that it is in Advanced Fortifications. Provides real defenses to Urban Defense Tactics.

    -Change Conscript Assault Package to Infantry Assault Package maintains conscript abilities but now lets penals also Hit the Dirt and gives penals smoke grenade;
    Makes this useful to penal builds, like the Infantry repair change. Giving smoke to penals is similar to how Panzer grens get smoke through Breakthrough equipment. Does not conflict with Shock Troops smoke as this ability is not on any commander with Shock Troops.

    Soviet Unit Changes

    Soviet Infantry and Support Weapons

    -Assault Guards: add upgrade path of 2x 1919 LMGs for 120 ammo;
    One of soviet's weaknesses is the lack of long range infantry dps and this change helps resolve that issue. Matches the theme of Lend Lease commander. It was a great change for both USF paratroopers variants to have access to all three upgrade paths of Thompsons, bazookas, and lmgs, so assault guards should be the same.

    -Penals: add upgrade path of 2x DP-28s for 75 ammo only available after Mobilize Reserves upgrade at Tankoviy Battalion or construction of Mechanized Armor Kampeneya;
    Penals are ideal for mid range and suffer from bad far dps even with vet. Giving DP-28s to penals gives them a late game upgrade to match 7 man cons.

    -Partisans: make PPSh upgrade free;
    The revised partisans are in a good spot now especially with 5th man on PPsh upgrade, which encourages the player to keep them to vet. However, PPSh upgrade should be free to match Storm troopers as the Partisans Tactics commander is already a heavy ammo user.

    -M-42 AT Gun: either increase canister shot range by 10, to total of 30 or change canister from a toggle with AP into it's own barrage;
    This unit does see some play despite being on only 2 commanders. It does its role well as a light vehicles deterrent but the canister shot for anti-inf is useless in it's current state. During one update the canister shot was nerfed from 40 to 20 because it was too OP against HMG teams. An improvement would be to either increase the canister shot range or change it into a small barrage ability like the 76mm Zis.

    Soviet Tanks

    -T-34/85: remove ram replace with smoke shell or Hunt ability from the Cromwell;
    This unit is too costly to be using ram. It should be replaced with any other ability to increase it's offensive power or survivability. If you need a ram, it is always useable on the T-34/76.

    -IS 2 Heavy Tank: reduce scatter slightly, increase pen slightly, and increase armor very slightly;
    This unit has not been seen at all since the great heavy nerf. Building it is a complete waste of resources better spent on literally anything else. It's accuracy on the main gun is so bad it can't vet up, struggles to pen even a panzer 4 with it's massive main gun, and armor is just embarrassing for being a heavy. All these factors combined make it not worth the cost of almost a king tiger. Recommend buffing very slighty and slowly just to make it a useable option again.

    -KV-1 Heavy Tank: reduce pop from 16 to 14, revert back to less hp but reduced incoming damage, reduce scatter, increase armor very slightly, and reduce cost by 50 mp to 370 and fuel by 10 to 135;
    Suffers all the same issues of the IS-2 but way worse. I haven never seen anyone make this unit either ally or enemy. It's role is to be a damage absorber like the Churchill but doesn't have the hp or armor. The gun is so terrible it can't vet to get it's hull down ability, the key selling point of this tank. You would pick the KV-8 every time over the KV-1 because at least the KV-8 is a strong anti-inf unit. Not sure why this unit was reverted back to longer repair while the Pershing was made shorter. Needs real buffs or a cheaper cost, maybe both, because 420mp and 145 fuel is too much to spend for almost nothing in return.

    Soviet Bugs

    Visual bug:
    When Penals repair anything they do not have any welding tools or masks equipped. Does not seem to affect repair speed just visually repair gear is missing.

    Historical/Visual bug:
    When a Commissar squad recrews a support weapon and then reinforces that captured support weapon it could have several commissar or medic models in the squad. This non-historical and certainly funny looking visual quark may upset some people. However, the game completely needed the change that all officers can recrew support weapons.

    Thank you for reading and taking these changes into consideration.

  • #36
    9 months ago
    yunusozgulyunusozgul Posts: 20
    edited April 2021


    -The IL-2 Suppression Strafe ability costs 45 Munitions, yet it isn't much useful. Therefore, either the ability itself should be developed or replaced with something handier such as recharge time reduction in the RGD-33 anti-personnel grenade ability.
    -Increase the accuracy bonus at veterancy 3 to 40% in order to reflect the true firepower of the 3x DP-28 light-machine guns that cost 100 Munitions.

  • #37
    9 months ago

    Addendum

    Soviet Commander Changes

    Conscripts Support Commander

    -Change Rapid Conscription into Fear Propaganda Artillery;
    Rapid Conscription is one of those abilities that has long been ignored by players and have unintentionally trained themselves to avoid. I am not sure any buff to this ability would make it desirable but the effort was appreciated. Fear Propaganda Artillery is in a much better state now after the rework. It seems appropriate in this commander and has a much greater chance of being used by the player.

    Shock Motor Heavy Commander

    -Change Armor Vehicle Detection into Recon Over Flight;
    Armor Vehicle Detection is another stale ability that is never used. It's never used because it is awkward to take advantage of and also rather boring. Recon Over Flight belongs here for two key reasons. First, it makes it similar to the elefant commanders that both have recon over flight. Second, it would make shock motor heavy a competitive option over the other ISU commander who is often picked for its marked target ability.

    Soviet Reserve Army Commander
    -Change Rapid Conscription into Incendiary Artillery Barrage;
    Again, Rapid Conscription fails because a vet zero con squad that will cost the player ammo, pop, and upkeep in the mid game isn't helpful. This commander lacked things to spend ammo on and Incendiary Artillery Barrage grants a useful off map ability.

    Soviet Shock Army commander
    -Change Armor Vehicle Detection into Team Weapon Drop;
    Clearing out an uninteresting ability for something with real utility. Team Weapon Drop is a perfect fit because in combination with the 120mm mortar the player has the option to completely skip the Support Weapon Kampaneya.

    Overall Commander Changes

    -152mm Artillery Strike reduce from 180 to 150:
    Yes, I realize it was raised in cost, but it either needs to be reduced back or buffed it in some way. This ability is clearly a copy of the 105mm Howitzer Barrage from the OKW salvage commander, except with some noticeable shortcomings. The Soviet version does not get the additional shell drops with excess ammo like the OKW one. Both OKW and Soviet versions are currently priced at 180 ammo, but if you fire both off so the OKW is not getting the extra shells dropped, the OKW one still drops more shells. Finally there is significantly more scatter in the Soviet version. All these factors totaled do not justify the high cost of the 152 Artillery Strike.

    Soviet Unit Changes

    -Standardize soviet flares at 35 ammo. Sniper from 40 to 35 and 82mm mortar from 30 to 35;
    Both of these flares last for 35 seconds and should be the same cost. This is reinforced by the fact the USF riflemen flare is also 35 seconds long and cost 35 ammo.

    -B4 203mm Artillery: Add new ability "Bunker Buster Shell" cost 100 ammo with vet 1 required. Bunker buster shell ability allows B4 to fire a shell like original B4 could (single shell, high damage) and shares cool down with standard three shell barrage. Direct shot moved to vet 2. Will have separate cool down from the other two barrages. Change direct shot damage from 400 to 600;
    I did it guys! I solved the great B4 crisis of 2021. Balance team can keep their vision of a barraging B4 203mm and everyone else can keep their trick shots (with just a little vet and ammo cost for balance). This change is historically accurate because the 203mm artillery in reality had several different shells varying in yield. The direct shot changes are necessary two-fold. The player should have to put in a little extra work for the gun to be able to defend itself from tanks. Also, on the slim chance an enemy tank is hit by a direct shot it should hurt dearly.

    -Airborne guards: Increase suppression on the vet 1 suppression strafe run ability. Increase costs from 45 to 50 ammo;
    After many online matches and testing sessions, the suppression strafe on soviet AB guards does little to nothing in terms of damage or suppression. Increasing suppression enough to suppress enemy troops in cover and pin those out of cover will make this ability usable. Raising the price to 50 ammo matches the cost on the luftwaffe officer's strafe ability.

    -DP-28 slot weapon: Slight improvements needed to dps. Further lower drop rate of DP-28;
    This weapon needs help in every occasion. On airborne guards they receive 3x DP-28s yet still do not deliver enough long range dps, often losing to gren or ober lmgs. Same issue on guards rifle infantry but worse because they are paying more per DP-28 and when the player reaches three models remaining only one DP-28 is left firing. Even if an axis squad were to pick one up off the ground (which is likely due to high drop rate) it may not be helpful.

    Soviet Bugs

    Missing ability:
    Airborne guards equipped with the assault package upgrade (which gives stationary camo now) are missing the hold fire ability. As myself and others have realized, this must be a bug or missed addition because a camo unit without hold fire isn't practical.

  • #38
    8 months ago

    I am here to report a bug concerning either the map "Alliance of defiance" or the Soviet Urban Defense Tactic Commander's "Convert to forward HQ" ability: I played at Alliance of defiance map and after trying every building in the map, not a single one was convertible to a forward HQ. It just gives the message "Requires: must be in supply" despite every building was in supply.

    I would also like to add a speculation that this kind of bug might extend to the UKF and Ostheer since they also have those same kinds of ability to convert civilian structures. I haven't tested those yet on this map, but I felt I had to mention my suspicion since I feel that could be also the case with said factions.

    Here are some buildings I've tried it on, but all of the buildings in the map were unconvertible regardless:



    I'll be back if I find out more about this bug, or find any other bugs in general.

  • #39
    8 months ago
    WAAAGH2000WAAAGH2000 Posts: 139
    edited May 2021

    Partisan should be cheaper,or more powerful ,maybe could be Soviet Stormtroopers?
    Assault Guards maybe should be call-in by about 320 MP?
    Conscripts reduce reinforcement cost buff maybe be passive same as Penal,or work on ppsh upgrade too.
    T34/85 RAM could replace by some other ability.
    ML-20 smoke should be free,or could use without vet,vet 1 be free
    All AT gun camoflage maybe could replace by tank hunter ambush

  • #40
    8 months ago
    KiethSomataw99KiethSoma… Posts: 111

    Partisan troops should at least be buffed a little as they are effective drive-by shooters on a M3A1 Scout Car. At least they should be able to assist engineers in planting Soviet Mines and Barbed Wire.

    Also, for the extra manpower for conscripts: I currently find it to be not worth the munitions spent as picking up a ground weapon is more helpful. Was thinking of a change for this upgrade:
    Increase the munitions cost of this squad upgrade, but is only mutually exclusive of the PPSH and PTRS squad packages. The squad can apply this upgrade if they are equipped with a heavy weapon they picked up off the ground and likewise, after that upgrade, the 7-man squad can still be equipped with a heavy weapon they pick up off the ground.

    Plus, for the T-70, was thinking of keeping its max figured killed per shot to 3, but removing the nerf to its rate of fire.

    Also was thinking for the ML-20 Howitzer: in addition to one more shot at Veterancy 1, unlock Distribute Medical Supplies Veteran ability. This heals the Howitzer crew and nearby infantry as well, as there's no other way to heal the crew.

  • #41
    8 months ago
    WAAAGH2000WAAAGH2000 Posts: 139

    About Ost relief infantry and Soviet rapid Conscription,now in Test mod is little useful than before,but maybe could more controllable,change “lost ”X infantry to call-in new infantry squad to “reinforced” X infantry to call-in new squad

  • #42
    8 months ago

    I just remembered and I want to draw attention, if anyone isn't aware or they just forgotten about, to the Lend Lease Tactics' M4C Sherman: Ever since the commander existed, the M4C Sherman is still missing an audio cue once built. This has been detrimental as with any unit you've failed to notice to arrive in the battlefield since you won't be able to use them at critical moments when they are most useful. Please at least give this, and other units that might not have audio cues, its own audio cue.

  • #43
    7 months ago

    This is a bug with the conscript and/or PPSH upgrade where the SMG's were still equipped when they crewed this USF M2HB .50 cal machine-gun:

    Usually when units get upgrades and then recrew decrewed team weapons, the models recrewing are supposed to lose their weapon upgrades and will use their stock weapons, in this case should've been Mosin rifles.

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